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Junior
01-17-2010, 03:02 PM
I know the rules say you have to run windows down, so I was wondering if I can run 1/4 windows for better aero. I want to run these and mount the mirriors to them.
http://i49.tinypic.com/219cj78.jpg

PaulB
01-17-2010, 05:50 PM
3 Intent
The intent of these rules is to provide mandates to ensure that all vehicles are modified within
clearly established limits, so as to ensure an even platform, in which a contest of driving skill
may provide the most talented drivers with great rewards. These rules provide the NASA series
administration a guideline to use when making decisions regarding NASA PT/TT. The intent of the
rules and safety considerations will be the overriding factors in making such decisions, as
opposed to a constrained interpretation of the rules based on phraseology or verbiage. The rules
shall be applied in a logical manner that seeks to provide competitors a safe and fair venue for
competition.

************************************************** *********
If a modification is not specifically allowed by the rules, it is prohibited. A permitted item
cannot be modified to perform either a prohibited function, or the function of an item that would
otherwise be assessed points under the modification rules. Vehicle legality is the sole
responsibility of the driver.

12) Front side window frame air dams/diverters (driver and/or passenger side) +2
ROLL CAGES:

This is the basic way to read most if not all NASA rules if it doesn't say you can your either illegal (DQ) or you take the points for finding a way to accomplish the same performance as another mod that was specified in the rules.

This is why other org's might have a phonebook thick rulebook full of approved mods....

Junior
01-17-2010, 06:28 PM
SO can I run a full window on the pass side and take the same points?

PaulB
01-17-2010, 07:10 PM
SO can I run a full window on the pass side and take the same points?


This is from the PT.TT rules
Front driver and passenger side fixed/Lexan windows are specifically not permitted
unless they are factory installed during the manufacturing of the vehicle. Both front side
windows must otherwise be in the down position while on track.

I sent a email for a National ruling.
I am concerned about the legality to simply get a race logbook. Since half or what ever the % of the original window area now isn't open or down --which is probably a safety thing.
(driver exit, visibility,rescue)
I was orginally just looking at this from a PT points perspective maybe just pointing as an air deverted but after looking at it???

I'll post the ruling...

Paul

Leland
01-17-2010, 08:39 PM
areo thing... if you covered less the window... or even some type of louver off the piller creating a whirl wind effect it may have the same effect. example the cab and tailgate of a pick up truck. just a tought.

travisjb
01-17-2010, 09:23 PM
might make more sense to do it like this with a curve like attached pic... that way it doesn't block so much of the window and violate any safety rules

let's decide once we hear back from Paul

also, Paul, I've noticed other sanctioning bodies allow full side windows - to your knowledge, do they have specific requirements for how the window fastens/unfastens? if national says we can't do the full window, would appreciate a 'why' response to go with it... thanks for looking into it :thumbsup:

PaulB
01-17-2010, 09:45 PM
NASA does allow closed windows in certain cars, I think the Porsche Cup cars came with Lexan windows that can be dropped.
A 370Z is not an allowed car and did not come with lexan side windows as the above rule states, so it's not legal to run them..
same thing for anything that blocks your view or impeds rescue or driver exit. Please contact Jim or Jeremy as that is there expertise..
---doesn't sound legal to me.

Keep in mind if your running TTS or ST2 aero is free (no points) but keep in mind race tech rules(log book) are different than TT tech rules.
(That is in the ST/TT rules)

It would be a very good idea to read the CCRs/Class rules completly before you build a car so it passes tech or ends up in a wrong class.

For race tech questions which is what you guys have
call Jim Fluckey at German Auto or jfluckey@cox.net

or if related to TT call Jeremy Ward at UMS jeremy@umstuning.com

travisjb
01-17-2010, 10:02 PM
okay paul, thanks for your note...

you're fighting the good fight on getting everyone to read the rules.... i did at one point, along with the 200 pages of other stuff I try to cram in my brain every day! :) we'll call the tech contact as you suggest and will also look forward to hearing back from you once you have a response from national. thx again

Leland
01-17-2010, 10:53 PM
was thinkin more something on the exterior, not blockn vision... but also with the car itself probably has had the areo stuff studied windows up or down at the fact already.

j0oftheworld
01-18-2010, 12:46 AM
I'm with leland on this one..

Dave "turtlespeed" Schutt
01-19-2010, 05:06 PM
guessing you could always throw on one of those wind deflectors over the leading edge. this will leave the window down and still provide rescue workers easy access. Ooooorrrrrr....you could make sure you lexan is really really clear and hope no one see's it. LOL.